How do you get your mind out of it’s usual ruts to find new and exciting solutions and ideas for your creative work? It’s more than just looking for new inspiration. It takes a little mental remodeling.
Find out more about this remodeling of the mind along with thoughts on learning design, embracing contradictions, and rising to the challenges that our art brings us. My guest Christine Dumont helps illuminate the reasons our brain gets stuck, offers steps to get ourselves out of our ruts, and shares her stories of crazy bold moves she’s taken in her life, regardless of starting out shy and doing a lot of transcontinental and career wandering.
Contact my guest:
www.facebook.com/christine.dumont.7
https://www.instagram.com/christine_g_dumont/
Email for classes: cdumont@allovercreation.net
Other Resources mentioned:
Ursula Morley Price: www.artnet.com/artists/ursula-morley-price/
Tehri Tolvanen: www.terhitolvanen.com/
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CREDITS:
Cover design by Sage; Illustration by Olga Kostenko
Music by Playsound
Transcript
AI Generated – excuse the copious mistakes [check back in a day or two (by Aug29) for a fully edited copy]
00:00:00 Christine–
Too often, stop short of just before and the clinical approach has given all it could grab the low hanging fruit. So go one step further to find new decks into what you already do.
00:00:19 Sage–
Hello all, my lovely creatives. Thank you for joining me on the Sage Arts podcast. This is sage. I am going to be joined shortly by our guest would say over the pond. Don’t know what they say in France.
00:00:31 Sage–
Well, the guest from Europe, so it’s a fantastic conversation. We’re going to be talking about shaking things up, mentally speaking to kind of improve our creativity, improve our work, help us find our voice, that kind of thing. So in the meantime, just to get us started, I have been crazy busy. So if you’re sending comments or whatnot on social media.
00:00:50 Sage–
Especially I’ve had a hard time getting on there. It’s been so crazy busy this week as many of you probably already know, Southern California got all kinds of craziness.
00:01:00 Sage–
Last weekend and it seemed to continue on through the week. Everybody seems to want to say that we had a hurricane, we did not have a hurricane, it wasn’t a hurricane. By the time it got here, it was a lot of water is what it was. It was a huge storm, a tropical storm, which we haven’t had. And I think it was 84 years since we’ve had one. So that was pretty.
00:01:17 Sage–
Dramatic, and I’m glad.
00:01:20 Sage–
The news and everybody who was talking about it was a little overly dramatic was a little kind of.
00:01:24 Sage–
Crazy, but the thing.
00:01:25 Sage–
Is everybody kind of stayed home. It reminded me of being in Colorado when there is an impending Blizzard and would all.
00:01:32 Sage–
Just go the.
00:01:32 Sage–
Door and and get all your snacks and get water and get everything that you need and then just everybody goes home and stays there. So that’s pretty much what happened is everybody stayed home, so there was very I think there’s one fatality down in Baja. But otherwise we fared pretty well. There’s a lot of roads that are damaged and various areas are still recovering from the amount of water.
00:01:52 Sage–
That they got, we got about 3 1/2 inches of my area. My sister got over 6 inches and this is in 20.
00:01:57 Sage–
4 hours so that.
00:01:58 Sage–
Is a lot of water Palm Springs. I don’t remember how much they got, but because their land, it doesn’t soak things up very well. They were completely flooded.
00:02:06 Sage–
Our national Parks Death Valley in particular, sustained a lot of damage, but as far as loss of life or injuries or whatnot, it was really very minimal. It was great that everybody stayed home because then.
00:02:18 Sage–
We had an earthquake.
00:02:20 Sage–
And we’re only about 20, maybe 2025 miles from the epicenter. So that’s pretty close. And we also live on a kind of land that’s.
00:02:27 Sage–
Has a high liquification factor. I don’t.
00:02:29 Sage–
Really understand the science of all.
00:02:31 Sage–
But we were rock.
00:02:32 Sage–
And rolling over here I was.
00:02:34 Sage–
I was working cuz that’s what I.
00:02:36 Sage–
Do and the laptop was kind of skidding across the desk, so I.
00:02:39 Sage–
Was like OK.
00:02:41 Sage–
I thought I thought something was running across the roof initially and I was like, Nope, Nope, that’s not it. And it’s not a truck. This is an earthquake. So that was fun. It’s kind of funny how Californians are about.
00:02:51 Sage–
Earthquake they’re really.
00:02:52 Sage–
More like most of the time, just like little roller coasters that you get in your house. But we’re just used to them and they can be very scary. This one was actually pretty scary because it went on a little.
00:03:02 Sage–
Younger and I thought it was going to grow into something bigger, but it ended up knocking over a vase and that was the extent of our.
00:03:08 Sage–
Damage. So as far as we can tell, so we are doing a lot of work on the House, which is also why this week’s been so crazy. So I have been orchestrating all this stuff the last few weeks and it’s been like having a second job and it’s not like I need a second job, so.
00:03:22 Sage–
In any case.
00:03:23 Sage–
That’s been my week. It should slow down after this next week. Next week’s like, Catch up on everything I haven’t.
00:03:28 Sage–
And this week, so for those of you who usually listen to this, like first thing Saturday morning or late Friday or whenever, I usually get it out, my apologies for this one being late. I just couldn’t manage to do everything I had to do and do a good job on this. In any case, let’s just take care of a few things before we join our guest. The chatter picked up this last week. I really appreciate that. Thank you for all your comments and your.
00:03:50 Sage–
Thoughts. I got a lovely note from Esther Ramiro. This was concerning the last episode on generosity, specifically the discussion around feeling selfish and maybe guilty about indulging one’s love of creativity if that’s something that you face. Esther, she doesn’t, she says. I may be selfish and I don’t feel guilty at all. I make art because it is like a therapy for me.
00:04:12 Sage–
It makes me happy. I share my art to inspire people and makes them happy by looking at nice art. Therefore, I make people around me happy too. That should be a.
00:04:20 Sage–
Enough. Absolutely, Esther. And it’s so nice and refreshing in our Western culture to recognize our right to do what makes us happy without apologies. Because the fact is, if we’re happy, we can make other people happy. It adds to the betterment of the world through that. So thank you so much, Esther, for sharing your views and thoughts. If you’d like to share.
00:04:40 Sage–
Their own views and thoughts. I’d love to hear from you. Whether it’s good, bad.
00:04:44 Sage–
Otherwise, send me whatever you’d like. You can do so by going to the show notes of this episode, or by reaching out on the website at the sagearts.com where you can go to the contact page. Just send me a message or to give back. You can stay on the home page, go halfway down to find the buy me a coffee and PayPal donation buttons, or sign up for that news and notices newsletter.
00:05:05 Sage–
By hitting the button at the top of the page and don’t forget to join on social media, on Facebook or Instagram at the Sage Arts Podcast.
00:05:12 Sage–
I just I have not been hearing reels. Like I said I would, so I’m gonna try to get that picked back up after things are a little quieter around here. So come join me there. Follow and comment as you see fit. OK, so that’s enough of that. Let’s go join our guest.
00:05:31 Sage–
My guest today is Christine DuMont. She’s a mixed media artist working in polymer, clay and other complementary materials. She is also quite the educator and innovator, not just in techniques but in design and the creative process in general. So I’m really happy to have your chance to chat with you today. Christine, thank you so much for joining us.
00:05:50 Christine–
Oh sage, I’m so chuffed to be here. Thanks for having me.
00:05:52 Sage–
Ohh chopped, I love that.
00:05:55 Christine–
Oh well, I lived in the UK.
00:05:57 Christine–
For a while.
00:05:57 Christine–
So pick up if she if she left crumbs along the way.
00:05:57 Sage–
Right. Yeah, yeah.
00:06:01 Sage–
I was going to say because that’s not French. You’re in France now, right?
00:06:04 Christine–
Yes, I live in Britney, which is the the part that sticks out on the French West Coast.
00:06:12 Sage–
Yeah. So you’re in France and?
00:06:13 Christine–
Yeah, I’ve been around the block few times I’ve been.
00:06:16 Christine–
I’ve lived in many countries.
00:06:18 Christine–
But I think now we’re settled here for this.
00:06:21 Sage–
Yeah. So we’re talking to you from France in early morning and me very late at night. So we’re we’re very curious to see who’s going to get tired first.
00:06:31 Sage–
Right. So, all right. Well for the listeners here, let’s let’s get to know you a little bit. When we first talk about your artistic and creative focus, what is it that you do as an artist and as a creative person?
00:06:45 Christine–
Well, my creative focus is to help other artists deepen or get more enjoyment.
00:06:52 Christine–
Or I would say get more.
00:06:55 Christine–
Out of their own creative journey and I use what I create as a tool to achieve that.
00:07:02 Sage–
Yeah. And you do this not just as an artist, but you’ve made a business out of this, would you say that’s correct?
00:07:09 Christine–
Yeah, the art has been my business for the past 60.
00:07:12 Christine–
Years and I would.
00:07:13 Christine–
Say I’m I’m really lucky to be able to.
00:07:16 Christine–
Make a living. Yeah, I.
00:07:17 Christine–
Had I’ve been around the block professionally a few Times Now.
00:07:24 Sage–
Well, so you make art, but your focus in your business.
00:07:28 Sage–
Is more about the education.
00:07:31 Christine–
Yeah, I guess I’ve always even as a child, I used to get my sisters together, teach them, and I was but.
00:07:42 Christine–
What about six years old? But I was just just to to explain, right? My university training is IT computer science. And I worked for many years as a software engineer and so didn’t do much teaching there. But.
00:07:44 Sage–
Ohh really wow.
00:08:01 Christine–
When I embraced the art as a career, teaching came hand in hand, and so that was totally unexpected.
00:08:08 Sage–
Yeah, you’ve had quite the journey. Let me ask you a couple of background questions about yourself. You you create art, primarily art, jewelry, and you have a business teaching. Do you have other passions besides the art and the teaching that do you think defines?
00:08:23 Christine–
You. Yeah. And I love the challenge and getting.
00:08:28 Christine–
Getting better at things or discovering new things is what really motivates me.
00:08:33 Christine–
While I’m a deep investigator in a class action lawsuit.
00:08:37 Sage–
Your lead investigator, you know, I don’t know why that doesn’t surprise me.
00:08:41 Christine–
It’s it’s white collar crime, so I’ve become a specialist in investment.
00:08:46 Sage–
Ohh that’s so crazy and this is just a small sampling folks of the craziness of.
00:08:50 Sage–
Christine’s life.
00:08:51 Christine–
So I have other fashions. I love cooking Moroccan and Middle Eastern food and lived in those countries, and I also have a large garden to look after and last but not least, I’m very difficulty to my.
00:09:05 Sage–
You keep busy. Yeah, the one thing that always impressed me about you is that you’re always very intense. You don’t do anything halfway very impressive. So Speaking of family, tell us, how do you think your family or friends see what you do? How would they describe what you do for a career?
00:09:22 Christine–
Well, let’s say that, you know, she’s always Trevor, not somewhere.
00:09:26 Christine–
And would love to see more of her, but she looks like she’s happy doing what she does so.
00:09:26
Right.
00:09:32 Christine–
So good, you know.
00:09:33 Sage–
So they’re not.
00:09:33 Sage–
Sure, but they’re just happy for you.
00:09:36 Christine–
Well, I have so many siblings, you know, I have like spare siblings. You know, that’s like.
00:09:40 Sage–
Yes, I have some spare siblings too. We could trade.
00:09:41 Christine–
So many of us.
00:09:45 Christine–
And so some of them are quite impressed with what I do and some of them just can’t come so.
00:09:53 Sage–
I think we have the same siblings. That’s funny. So I always ask this question.
00:10:00 Sage–
And I almost wasn’t going to ask you this question about being a planner or a pantser.
00:10:06 Christine–
The answer insanely much on a planner. Yeah, it’s beyond for me beyond conception. I mean, I can’t imagine living your life, you know, not planning. However, as you’re gonna dig further into my life, you’re going to see that.
00:10:24 Christine–
And then could she things wearing the Panthers hat?
00:10:27 Sage–
Yeah, you’re so spontaneous.
00:10:29 Sage–
In there.
00:10:30 Christine–
Yeah, I guess I’m a mixed bag.
00:10:35
All right. Well, we’ve.
00:10:36 Sage–
Been kind of dancing.
00:10:37 Sage–
Around your journey and all the things that you’ve done, so can you briefly tell us, when did you first find that you liked to create things, and how did you get from there to what you.
00:10:52 Christine–
Doing now? Well, my dad was an architect, and so we grew up in a culture of seeking beauty and all that stuff. So our ideal traveling with my parents was to go and visit museums all the time. So, you know, that was very much ingrained. And my mom was an art lover. But then at the age of 18.
00:11:13 Christine–
I was then living with my family in Morocco when I shed high school. I said to my parents. So listen, I I don’t want to continue living my life in France. I want to speak English. That’s what I want to do. So I’m going to say goodbye to you and I’m gonna.
00:11:28 Sage–
You’re so independent.
00:11:31 Christine–
I was 18 and my family’s Belgian, even though we lived in Morocco, the idea was to eventually come back to Belgium and I would have started university in Belgium. But I said no, no, no, I’m going to go off to Canada and I studied computer science in Canada. I thought about, you know, occur in art. So I register at the University of Toronto.
00:11:51 Christine–
The Arts program Fine Arts and I took a few courses, but eventually the computer work was so intense that I left that behind and so I worked for a long time as software engineer and then as a management consultant where I learned business skills.
00:12:10 Christine–
And then, as so many people do, I got to burnout. And I thought I had to reinvent myself. Yeah. And so I taught myself screen writing and but not an easy life. I don’t regret having spent so much time writing because now not so much about screen writing that I’m using now in my.
00:12:30 Christine–
During career, but writing is terribly isolating and and one day I lived in Canada when I was crossing the street waiting for the light to turn green, and I thought to myself, you cannot continue living this way. And I I I looked around and didn’t they were coming out of the store.
00:12:48 Christine–
Looking so happy and I said I want what they have. I don’t care what they say. This is the answer here. I don’t care. I want what they have. So I went and looked at what the store was and it was a jewelry store. I walked into the store and I said to the owner, I said, can I show you my jewelry collection?
00:13:08 Christine–
Look to you and I said, well, it’s actually my husband who does the buy. So come back on Tuesday, I said I’ll be back Tuesday, come home and said to MM I’m a jeweler. He says what’s wrong with you? That’s not. That’s not who you are.
00:13:22 Christine–
I said you’re not happy with me as I am. You know, I’m terribly unhappy. I have to cheat something. So it says. OK. It’s not you. What? What can I do to help you? I said, well, drive. Miss Daisy, take me to the beach store.
00:13:38 Christine–
To drive me there. And so I picked some beats to make a Long story short, went back on Tuesday with five pairs of earrings. That was like jewelry collection. You’re searching. The buyer says. Well, that’s that’s good. Where are the Penguins? I hear it’s coming.
00:13:39 Sage–
You’re working on this.
00:13:56 Christine–
Four weeks to put together.
00:13:57 Christine–
I guess, I mean, I had no experience and do we were so far from my interest.
00:14:03
So I like.
00:14:03 Sage–
How you just went backwards you went?
00:14:05 Sage–
And tried to get.
00:14:06 Sage–
A connection in the jewelry world. And then you went and learned how to make jewelry is.
00:14:10 Christine–
That what you’re saying? Yes, that’s the word of thinking, I suppose. But you know, when you’re desperate to do anything.
00:14:18 Christine–
Just a bold.
00:14:19 Christine–
So this guy said to be a Christian? Yeah. OK, that’s fine. I’ll sell your tenants. But let me give you.
00:14:25 Christine–
Some advice if you want to get anywhere, you have to make your beads. Anybody can go into the store and I said you’re right. And so I did market research. What’s the cheapest way to get into Jewish? Because I thought, you know, you still don’t know whether you’re like to do this.
00:14:46 Christine–
So the guy who sold me the beats, he was a geologist and quite well into all aspects of jewelry. Bless him. He told me a gemologist. So I found a block of putting her clay and it was hit at first sight.
00:14:57 Christine–
Ohh really? Yes.
00:15:09 Christine–
Thank God we’re gonna Michael do.
00:15:10 Christine–
Sister and I thought, OK, you’re not gonna lose your way once more. Stick to it. So I stuck to it and and now I can’t disengage from politics. It’s just I still discover so many stuff about McCray. That, and I think it’s a wonderful media to teach design. So that’s.
00:15:30 Christine–
That’s right.
00:15:31 Sage–
I think most of people who find their art medium, it’s tends to be kind of incidental. Yours is much more intentional, except that it’s just kind of came from the side. That’s that’s a pretty incredible story that you have to to get to where you are now.
00:15:44 Sage–
Also, is there anything about this path that you took, anything that you’ve done or made or perceived that you wish you had done, maybe from the?
00:15:54 Christine–
Start of your career.
00:15:55 Christine–
No, no, actually I seem dead. My stars are lined up in the right position because all the things I learned.
00:16:05 Christine–
During my sort of checkered career.
00:16:11 Christine–
It’s so useful now. You know my computer skills and use them to build a platform that was before using Facebook as a platform for teaching. I’m using a lot of logic in our approach. My work with my students, the skills I learned in screen writing, importance of timing.
00:16:30 Christine–
For instance, all these things have, you know, landed me in some ways. So I feel confident in what I do, not because I have experience, but because I have self-reliance. I mean, I know how I can learn. I don’t know something that can go and.
00:16:31 Sage–
Uh-huh. Yeah.
00:16:46 Christine–
It right and I also have my own life experience. I know what it’s like to be unhappy with your art or having difficulties with certain aspects of it. And because I had difficulties with it too, you know, so it can be more to my my students.
00:16:59 Sage–
Yeah, right.
00:17:02 Sage–
Connect with their experience, yeah.
00:17:04 Christine–
Yeah, so now I’m really happy how things happen. OK, I.
00:17:09 Christine–
I’m the happiest now in my career so.
00:17:12 Sage–
Ohh, I’d love to hear that. Yeah, that’s great. So when we first started talking, I don’t know if I’ve.
00:17:12 Christine–
That’s great about.
00:17:20 Sage–
Mention this to you listeners, but I spend time with the artist first determining like kind of the subject matter, the things that we want to talk about, things that we have an interest in collectively and you and I talked about mindset like the way people think and being able to change one’s mindset and finding ways to think differently.
00:17:39 Sage–
So let’s start with.
00:17:41 Sage–
Your definition of what this is this subject matter that we’re talking about.
00:17:45 Sage–
What kind of change?
00:17:46 Sage–
In artists mindset, were you referring to?
00:17:49 Christine–
I I want to talk about the model of the mind that I use, which is organic, I think and it’s, you know, Edward, the born natural thinking.
00:17:58 Sage–
Edward de Berno yeah.
00:17:59 Christine–
You know what natural thinking is?
00:18:01 Sage–
Yeah, basically creative problem solving.
00:18:03 Christine–
He is perhaps the first person to look at thinking as a skill he came up with this lovely metaphor for the brain.
00:18:12 Christine–
The general.
00:18:14 Christine–
So think of the brain as.
00:18:18 Sage–
Like gelatin? Like jello. OK, OK, Bobby. OK.
00:18:20 Christine–
General. Yeah. General blobby. Yeah. Yeah. It’s sort of breaking shivering mass and which you learn your experiences are like hot ink that you pour on that Genuity, that hot ink creates grooves. The following day, same experiences deepened.
00:18:25 Sage–
OK.
00:18:40 Christine–
So after a while those glues are so set that it’s impossible to think in a different way. So that’s basically what’s happening with the brain. The synapses are creating such established and such strong linkages that it’s difficult to change that you either create.
00:18:59 Christine–
Network so loose or you try to overlay a new network over existing rules, or you do lateral thinking, which is basically create assurance from an established.
00:19:11 Christine–
I I did a lesson degree in cognitive science and it’s about, for instance, who spent a lot of time learning about vision and how the eye perceives. And that’s lateral thinking and sense. I like that to design, but I want to talk about a major groove in the directing.
00:19:31 Christine–
It’s the fear, grooving artist, yeah.
00:19:34 Christine–
There is such a strong strong rule there which is so difficult to overcome. We are fearful of so many things. You know, we are afraid of taking ownership of our design. We’re taking ownership of what people are going to think about. All we’re fearful of the likes or not. It’s not just for the artist. It’s generalized.
00:19:54 Christine–
There is a risk involved with anything and we’re truthful with that.
00:19:57 Christine–
That’s to me, is one of the main things I’m trying to work with with my students, and to find ways of alleviating.
00:20:07 Christine–
The fear and feeling that Ruth with more productive growth filling it with other ideas, you know, so that they don’t think about the fear, but their mind is focused on other, more productive thoughts. Like am I happy doing what I’m doing? How could I enhance my happiness doing it?
00:20:25 Christine–
And if you fill your mind with so much more.
00:20:27 Christine–
Interesting and happy thoughts.
00:20:30 Sage–
Thinking of the fear right is this something that you’ve done personally for yourself? Remodeling your brain? And how did that work?
00:20:38 Christine–
For you, you know how fearful is. When I walked into this jewelry store.
00:20:42 Sage–
You didn’t sound.
00:20:42 Sage–
Fearful. I mean, you did it and you know.
00:20:45 Christine–
Well, I think I’ve done that quite a few times, but for instance, I was terribly, terribly shy.
00:20:50 Christine–
My life. Well, I can’t keep living my life being afraid of presenting with myself to other people and speaking, especially if I’m going to be a teacher. So I thought, OK, So what do you suggest? Christine? I said, OK, Christine, this is what you gonna do? You’re going to learn how to say now and then.
00:20:59 Sage–
Yeah, yeah.
00:21:09 Sage–
I was hoping you’d bring up this story.
00:21:12 Christine–
Yeah. Same in public. OK, so I I, I took singing lessons, which was great because again, I learned so many new things. And and after a while I thought, OK, I’m good enough. And then we had moved back to Canada and there was a hotel where you had, like, an open mic this week. So I just showed up there.
00:21:33 Christine–
I was so scared.
00:21:34 Christine–
But now she can’t shut me up.
00:21:38 Sage–
You say you’re fearful, but you do these things that other people, the fear would stop them. So your ability to just move forward through the fear is that something innate in you or is that?
00:21:50 Sage–
Something you had to learn.
00:21:52 Christine–
Ohh I had to learn that. Yeah, but again, you know you’ve known me only post here.
00:21:57 Sage–
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:22:00 Christine–
Well, maybe it’s ingrained in how I see the world, but if you’ve got a problem, solve it. Don’t live with it for the rest of your life, because there are other things to do. Then just dwell in sheer. Yeah, so I’m I’m very deliberate intentionally and identifying problem and identifying solution.
00:22:06 Sage–
That’s right.
00:22:17 Sage–
So has that been something you’ve done all your life? I mean that the problem arises and you try to find the solutions that been.
00:22:23 Sage–
Since you were young.
00:22:24 Christine–
Yeah, I have mine said that says if there’s a problem that if you’re facing chaos, try to find a structure in it so you understand it and just through the understanding.
00:22:38 Christine–
In a society trying to fix it, you would make friends with chaos. You make friends with a difficult situation.
00:22:46 Sage–
Yeah. OK. So some of it sounds like you had some of the tools you would need to remodel your brain yourself.
00:22:53 Sage–
Self. And so now you’re out there. You’re teaching, you’re trying to help people find new ways to think you’ve done a lot of teaching. And to me, it’s always been with an eye to introducing new concepts or maybe teaching old concepts that might be new to your students or pushing the students ideas about art and what they create.
00:23:15 Sage–
Did you plan that just part of your class objectives and your approach?
00:23:20 Christine–
I act more like a male saying that I can give you tools. It’s for you to decide whether you want to.
00:23:26 Christine–
Pick them.
00:23:26 Christine–
Up or not? Yeah. And I’m ferocious to active towards, you know, re remodeling, rewiring myself, but that is not, you know, in my mindset to do with other people. But I see people grafting these problems.
00:23:41 Christine–
And my approach to them is to take them through frameworks. Same frameworks I use and see if that can help some.
00:23:50 Christine–
We have more options that we think and so by showing them options for them to decide, yeah. But also we decide to take on a course of action if the person who presents this course of action shows that they’re happy. Having followed this. So I hope that by projecting happiness.
00:24:10 Sage–
Yeah, right. Right.
00:24:11 Christine–
So I’m the jewelry store.
00:24:15 Sage–
Now you’re the one behind the counter. Yeah, exactly.
00:24:19 Sage–
Yeah. So, but in the way you teach.
00:24:21 Sage–
You’re offering them these tools and these options, and I know I’ve seen the results of people taking your class where they started and where they end and there’s some really dramatic changes in the.
00:24:34 Sage–
Work that your students have been producing.
00:24:36 Sage–
And the artwork that.
00:24:37 Sage–
They’ve done do.
00:24:37 Sage–
You have like a favorite story about a student being able to turn around their thinking after taking one of your classes or something that reflects this approach to trying to do better with the artwork through minds.
00:24:51 Christine–
I have so many examples of people saying, you know, I found my voice. So yeah, I’ve got lots of that. And often the work shows the gratefulness because when people show you work they’ve done like two years after you’ve started the class, that means it stayed was done. That in itself is gratifying.
00:25:07 Sage–
Right.
00:25:11 Christine–
Yeah. And also when you see somebody who’s already got a style but was able to lift that using some of your methods, you know people can be very nice with words, but they don’t show it was to work, you know, that’s that’s what matters to me.
00:25:26 Sage–
Yeah, yeah.
00:25:28 Christine–
But the most amazing feedback I’ve received as part of the salmon net team is that just couple of days ago we had a meeting with just more salmon net Nepali sisters. I think your audience knows about them.
00:25:41
Right. Well.
00:25:42 Sage–
If they listen to the interview with Wendy Moore, we talked significantly about this. I’m not women in Nepal. It’s an organization that helps women who have been abused domestically or trafficked or whatnot and are learning to be independent and make their own.
00:25:58 Christine–
Money. Yeah. Some of them are learning the jewelry business with when you started that a long time ago. And I joined the team about a year and a half ago. They were basically I’m complementing the amazing work that they been doing, which was to expose them to design and a couple of days ago they showed.
00:26:17 Christine–
Us the necklace.
00:26:18 Christine–
And they had completely conceptualized themselves. And these people have an education system, which is so different from ours, where compliance is the rule.
00:26:28 Christine–
Right. So they said.
00:26:29 Christine–
We’re not only developing a skill, we are developing a sense of identity. We are artists. Great. Yeah. I mean, rediscovering a new world life. Yeah, that’s what matchups. So, yeah, that that was, you know, the best accolade.
00:26:37 Sage–
Yeah, the.
00:26:47 Sage–
Yeah, that a lot of.
00:26:47 Sage–
Those women had no personal identity. Yeah, they’re nobodies. They were a possession or they belonged to somebody. So to have that through the work that they’ve been doing through the jewelry that they’ve been making through the art that.
00:26:58 Sage–
They’ve been making this wonderful.
00:26:59 Christine–
Yeah. And also they’re like a hive. They have a collective approach to art. It’s just so.
00:27:04 Sage–
Right.
00:27:05 Christine–
Beautiful, you know.
00:27:06 Sage–
Yeah, it really.
00:27:07 Sage–
Is have there been difficulties? Things that you’ve run into with students that just were resistance to finding new ways to think about what they’re doing?
00:27:17 Christine–
Well, I think if they were to give missent of who I am, I think those classes are difficult because I take the business of where do very seriously.
00:27:28 Christine–
And I get out my way to help people.
00:27:31 Christine–
And if you don’t have the same commitment, it’s more difficult to reach. But yeah, I’m not judgmental. I know there are a lot of people do this because they have a need to network and it gives them a way of connecting with people. I think that’s wonderful. Yeah. And I’m OK with this, but perhaps these people will have more of an issue with how I engage with them.
00:27:51 Sage–
In the classroom.
00:27:52 Christine–
In the classroom.
00:27:54 Christine–
Yes, when you open the door to design.
00:27:57 Christine–
You are asking people to take responsibility for their work, which is quite different from when you’re teaching a technique, because teaching a technique is basically replicating something that you have been taught to do, and then you can find.
00:28:16 Christine–
Variations on your own, but when you’re teaching design, they have to engage with what they like, what they see in design that is defining their view of the world.
00:28:28 Christine–
And that takes confidence and it takes commitment. And so that is the step that I find difficult as the Rubicon, if you want. Yeah. People have to make that jump and say, OK, this piece people might not like it, but it reflects who I am.
00:28:49 Christine–
And I’m going to stick with that and I’m going to develop that until, you know, find a happy compromise between what I like and how it’s received. So, yeah, that’s, I think, a difficult.
00:29:00 Christine–
The challenge?
00:29:00 Sage–
It’s a challenge. Yeah, cause people have to, like, dig down. They have to face things. They may not be comfortable with about themselves or just being able to have that feeling like their opinions may not be correct or right. And it’s like, well, this is what you’d like. No one else has to like it.
00:29:14 Christine–
Yeah. And that’s a practical issue. You cannot explain design over a period of two days, right? And that’s why during COVID, I was able to run these classes over two months minus.
00:29:27 Christine–
And that’s what it takes to open that door and take the time. And what’s so wonderful that they’re supporting each other. Whereas when you’re teaching a class and then we work periods 2 days and leave, yeah, there isn’t decent travel interaction either. Yeah. Right. So.
00:29:43 Christine–
Learning is really, really helpful in your.
00:29:47 Christine–
Topics of design.
00:29:48 Sage–
Yeah, it’s supportive and it keeps it alive for them because they know other people are doing the same thing as they are. And I’m absolutely with you on that. Yeah, that’s the difficulty of of doing the things that we do where we only have a limited time. Like I only have an hour for a podcast, you know? So I can only say.
00:30:03 Sage–
So much so, yeah, like right now I’m doing a little bit of design at the beginning of each month, hoping that people will focus on it for the month. But you’re right, when there is a community, when there are people to connect with on, it is just going to spend more time with it and it’s going to be kind of a top of the.
00:30:17 Sage–
Mind subject for that?
00:30:18 Sage–
Time period, right, I think all.
00:30:21 Sage–
Of us who have been.
00:30:22 Sage–
Making efforts to teach design.
00:30:23 Sage–
Especially where people aren’t necessarily trained in the arts when they come to it, sometimes it’s an uphill battle, yeah, but definitely worthwhile.
00:30:31 Christine–
One of the main difficulty I face when in exploring design business students.
00:30:39 Christine–
We are no longer in the situation where we analyze a piece and say this piece works beautifully because there’s enough contrast or there is unity or that you can analyze pieces till the cows come home and it’s when you are in the room with them and they’re bringing there, there’s elements.
00:30:59 Christine–
And they come.
00:31:00 Christine–
To you and say this doesn’t say, how do I make this saying?
00:31:04 Christine–
Moving forward, you have to think really fast.
00:31:07 Christine–
On your feet.
00:31:08 Sage–
Yeah, right. Yeah.
00:31:09 Christine–
And of course, you’re going to say this is what I like. You’ve got to put these pieces together the way you like, and they do. And it doesn’t sing. So you say, well, I will do that. Ohh, yeah. How’d you do that?
00:31:24 Christine–
I don’t know.
00:31:25 Sage–
It’s because it’s who you are that you’ve been able to get in touch and identify those things about what you like. And then the understanding of design through time.
00:31:34 Sage–
Yeah, I’ve had the same experiences with people. Design is a really difficult thing to teach because it’s not an individual concept, it’s a practice. It’s an ongoing experience.
00:31:43 Christine–
It’s a practice.
00:31:46 Christine–
And also the artist if you are teaching, you pursue your own meanderings, all these principles and the one you like and you have your way of doing this. Yeah, but when you are trying to explore design with other people, you can just stick to what you like.
00:32:03 Christine–
You’ve got to have a much broader view of things and embrace things that is not your taste but has merit. So that is certainly a challenge.
00:32:05
Right.
00:32:14 Sage–
Yeah, right. I think for all of us.
00:32:16 Sage–
Yeah, you know, you said once.
00:32:18 Sage–
To me, I really love this phrase. You said that you see design as practical friends for an artist now. Is that something that you try to get people to experience when you’re teaching these concepts of design? Have you figured out a way for people to see design as practical?
00:32:34 Sage–
Friends for them.
00:32:35 Christine–
Yeah. First of all, I don’t send them.
00:32:38 Christine–
Off on the Internet to look at principles of design, I made them discover, for instance, in a piece elements of art. I don’t tell them elements of art. At this they discover what their it’s all about they discovered. So I tried.
00:32:54 Christine–
To make things that.
00:32:55 Christine–
Huge example that they can directly relate to.
00:32:58 Christine–
And so it’s never didactic, it’s never theoretical. I use the Socratic method with them. Say it. So tell me how you feel about your peace, you’ll say? Well, not.
00:33:11 Christine–
OK. What is it? You’re not sure about? Is it the color of other things you talked about you guys about and in the end they discovered what’s wrong. And so I said what I’ve done with you, you do it with your son. Now next time you’re facing a piece that’s. So they rehearse and I find really an important thing to do with them is to say.
00:33:30 Christine–
OK, this is what I see in your pic.
00:33:34 Christine–
Art is communication. You’re doing something and you expect some feedback and the feedback is so hard to get through most people. So yeah, this is how I’m emotionally react to your piece. I find it peaceful, thoughtful, mysterious, blah, blah, blah. It’s the feedback that matters many people have.
00:33:54 Christine–
Myself to and translating emotion into design.
00:34:00 Sage–
It’s kind of like a thing where like you’re trying to explain emotion with logic there, because if you try to think about design while you’re trying to translate emotion, like when I write poetry, I try not to be too awake. So I tend to do.
00:34:13 Sage–
It when I.
00:34:13 Sage–
First, wake up because it takes me.
00:34:14 Sage–
Like hours to actually.
00:34:15 Sage–
Be lucid, but I don’t want the logical side in.
00:34:20 Sage–
The mix while I’m creating my poetry because it doesn’t click and I find that to be true with art as well. That thinking about design as you initially create doesn’t, at least for me, I mean, there’s probably some people.
00:34:32 Sage–
Works for great, but it is trying to do 2 things at once and two rather oppose things at once, right, and then bringing the logic in later as a problem solving series of tools.
00:34:42 Christine–
Yes, yeah, yeah, I must say that now, over the years, I’m becoming more intuitive with my artist. It’s less of a logical game, but it, you know.
00:34:53 Christine–
It takes time.
00:34:54 Sage–
Yeah, but that’s why it’s a practice, because you need to practice it in order that the logical brain doesn’t get in there. If you’re trying to talk about emotion, it isn’t a logical experience. So trying to translate it logically doesn’t always get to the essence of what that emotion is because you’re using like the wrong language.
00:35:14 Sage–
Try to explain it.
00:35:15 Sage–
And you need to feel like if you can feel your art as you’re making it, if you have a particular emotion that you’re trying to convey and you can actually.
00:35:21 Sage–
Like feel out.
00:35:23 Sage–
Your work. What a hard thing to teach, right?
00:35:25 Christine–
Yeah. Yeah, well, you know, I, I.
00:35:28 Christine–
Don’t pretend that I can teach them everything. I think I can just etch.
00:35:32 Christine–
Them on their.
00:35:32 Christine–
Way kind of thing. You know? Just move them along and then somebody else would come along.
00:35:33 Sage–
Right.
00:35:37 Sage–
Serendipity will come along and provide what they need. Yeah, yeah.
00:35:41
Well, kind of.
00:35:41 Sage–
Going back to this idea about thinking differently.
00:35:44 Sage–
Do you have?
00:35:45 Sage–
Any practical steps that listeners can take to?
00:35:48 Sage–
Help them get some lateral thinking going remodeling.
00:35:54 Sage–
All these new words they’re running around is there’s.
00:35:57 Sage–
Is there something that?
00:35:57 Sage–
They can do to help them think differently. That would increase their enjoyment and maybe even the authenticity and uniqueness of the work that they’re creating.
00:36:08 Christine–
Yeah, you’d be surprised if I didn’t have any before. OK, so I’ve got three major approaches. First one is to do some.
00:36:10 Sage–
I would be.
00:36:10 Sage–
Very surprised if we didn’t have it.
00:36:19 Christine–
And different. The second one is to embrace contradictions and the third one is to be different. So let me take those in turn. So to do something different, you can engineer change or you can let change happen organically. So I I practice both, you know, obviously.
00:36:26 Sage–
OK.
00:36:35 Sage–
Right.
00:36:39 Christine–
Me walking into this jewelry store was both. It was it was an engineer change. I have to do something different. What was it? I wasn’t happy. Why? I was unhappy because I was lonely. And what were these people?
00:36:51 Christine–
Doing they were having.
00:36:53 Christine–
Common experience they were talking to each other. I wanted that. So that was the engineer side.
00:36:58 Christine–
Then deciding to become a juror that was or. Then I didn’t know what was going to happen, you know? So I am very strongly opinionated about if there’s something that doesn’t work fine, what the problem is, address it and take the time to sit down and.
00:37:14 Christine–
Do it, yeah.
00:37:15 Christine–
Don’t let it simmer forever.
00:37:18 Christine–
Think about that change happen organically. Just change the context in which.
00:37:23 Christine–
Work for. It’s just like very recently decided I was really stuck on the phone. I thought how can I buy the phone? I’m thinking well, but there’s that phone. That’s better. I’m wearing between these two forms and doing nothing right. So I thought, OK, how can I change that?
00:37:39 Christine–
I’m gonna go.
00:37:40 Christine–
And and scavenge for for wood pieces of the woods.
00:37:44 Christine–
And they will give me the phone instead of inventing my phone. So. So I did a bunch of pieces using borrowed forms and let the phones.
00:37:56 Christine–
And then I can always go back to using these stored forms and translate them into polymeric. I need to and that was mine opening. I was really good. It was gorgeous organic learning here. So change your source of inspiration. You know it’s your inspiration comes from Pinterest.
00:38:16 Sage–
Then yeah, you’re kind.
00:38:17 Sage–
Of limited honestly.
00:38:19 Christine–
As you grow and get face to face, inspiration going to the world.
00:38:23 Christine–
You are going to museums and that you will travel and travel.
00:38:27 Sage–
Yeah, that’s the best.
00:38:30 Christine–
Yeah. So I’m going to move on to embrace contradictions. That’s a favorite of mine.
00:38:35 Sage–
Can you hear a?
00:38:36 Christine–
Walking contradiction. Sorry, we can contradict your wisdom or.
00:38:46 Christine–
You can contradict your seeing wisdom. So for instance, I was contradicting my own wisdom when when I jumped in this jewel very jewel was so poor.
00:39:00 Christine–
Where you can find a lot of contradiction in received wisdom is focusing on the material that you use. For instance, if you know the jeweler Terry to abandon.
00:39:11 Sage–
I don’t think so.
00:39:12 Christine–
She makes a lot of jewelry out of.
00:39:14 Christine–
But but she really works. The contradictions between man made and the natural world. So she overlays the word with a lot of metal fabrication. And you see that and you see the tension between the two worlds. So that’s a contradiction because, you know, it’s so well, if I’m going to work in this world, I want to would.
00:39:34 Christine–
To shine or whatever.
00:39:36 Sage–
And how do how do you spell your last?
00:39:37 Christine–
NTOLVANEN.
00:39:41 Sage–
TOLVAN. OK. Just wanted to make sure we caught that and listeners, if you hear any other artists or references, remember all of those will be listed in the show notes.
00:39:51 Christine–
Yeah. Another very favorite artist of mine who actually got me thinking about art was earthly Morley price. She’s a ceramicist, but she makes pots that are like a successional veins. If you want. They’re very, very fine veins. And for her and dilating forms look like.
00:40:12 Christine–
The effect of the breeze on the wave, I mean, so basically you transcend.
00:40:17 Christine–
The notion that ceramics or earth is heavy and and compact, and you may just use the productions and a lot of other ceramicists have followed in her steps by making ceramics look fragile, and so the contradiction is you think your material is one thing and you make it look like another thing.
00:40:38 Christine–
So for me it was to find poetry in polymer clay because polymer clay is not a poetic material to start with, and so that has always been a guiding principle for me. No matter what I’ve been doing me right from the beginning. Yeah, take your matches and the castle. They traverse the world of painting and and cups.
00:40:58 Christine–
You know, that’s also contradiction. I mean, they wouldn’t painters and to go and do cutouts, right. They embrace contradictions because that’s where you find the.
00:41:08 Christine–
And so be different, and perhaps again in the big difference, there is a major contradiction to embrace. Be more of yourself. You know, be too often stop short of just before an A technical approach has given all it could. You know, he grabbed the Lohan.
00:41:27 Christine–
So go one step further to find new depth into what you already do.
00:41:34 Christine–
No, the the grass is greener on your side of the fence. I believe that just keep digging.
00:41:40 Sage–
Yeah. Well, there’s a number of teachers and various people have said over the years in my experience and just in general, that you should never just make something once or twice. You need to make it like 12 times or 20 times before you really learn what you’re making. What the design is, what you’re trying to say. So oftentimes we.
00:42:00 Sage–
Get into something that we’re interested in. We make it once is I I’m definitely guilty of this and we’re just excited about it. We make that one thing and we kind of see where it goes and then we’re like, oh, I want to go on to the next new thing and you don’t explore.
00:42:11 Christine–
That’s right, yeah.
00:42:12 Sage–
Fully. But when people look at somebody who’s so skilled and the work is so controlled, like their intention is very obvious and they’ve been able to create exactly what they want to create because they spend the time really working through what it is they’re saying, what they’re trying to do, honing their skills, all those kinds of things.
00:42:33 Sage–
And doing new stuff and trying new techniques and new materials or not is very exciting, yes, but it doesn’t always get you to the point in the work or in the understanding of what you’re doing that you could, if you spent all that time.
00:42:46 Sage–
With it totally.
00:42:47 Christine–
Agree. Yeah, yeah.
00:42:49 Christine–
And so to be different be the different you. And then there’s be completely be completely different by surrounding yourself with people who are in the same wavelengths. You’re going to give you feedback you need to, you know, elevate your conversation.
00:43:09 Christine–
And then or retrain yourself by creating new habits, like. That’s really heavy engineering. But for instance, I’ve decided that year ago that I needed to be an athlete.
00:43:22 Christine–
You did.
00:43:25 Sage–
All the things you decide then just go do.
00:43:28 Christine–
OK, but this one used to be really hard because.
00:43:32 Christine–
I don’t like exercise.
00:43:34 Sage–
Yeah, yeah.
00:43:35 Christine–
And so I’m trying to find all kinds of ways of motivating myself. So I have managed to achieve results, but I haven’t like physically not more **** and all that. But I haven’t managed to find happiness in it yet, which is gonna happen eventually to the bottom of that one.
00:43:55 Christine–
So that’s it.
00:43:56 Sage–
Because it’s a challenge, yeah.
00:43:59 Sage–
So you got to do it.
00:44:01 Sage–
Well, that’s great. There are steps in there that everybody could choose where to start and trying to just think differently and and find different paths that will grow their work and but hopefully grow their enjoyment and fulfillment in their art. So thank.
00:44:14 Sage–
You. Well, a couple of little.
00:44:16 Sage–
Closing questions. So what would you say is the most important lesson?
00:44:19 Sage–
You’ve learned over your career.
00:44:21 Sage–
Like for you personally, what is one thing that really strikes you, and it might be something worth.
00:44:27 Sage–
Resilience. Resilience. Yeah.
00:44:30 Christine–
It means that I know that life is going to throw you lemons, your heart throws you lemons, everybody’s your soap. You throw yourself lemons. But I’m developing methods to overcome that, you know, by being more balanced, you know, if suddenly I couldn’t do art because I lost my hands, OK.
00:44:46 Sage–
Oh my gosh. Yeah.
00:44:48 Christine–
So it could happen. You know, people have us. Yeah. Yeah, it could happen well.
00:44:49 Sage–
That’s what happened.
00:44:52 Christine–
I’ll go back to singing.
00:44:56 Sage–
But you know a lot to choose.
00:44:57 Christine–
From so yeah. But you know, I prepared it, you know, all kinds of horrible things can happen. So we.
00:45:04 Christine–
Prayer creates redundancy in your life.
00:45:07 Sage–
Yeah, I think that’s been a subject matter on and off through the last handful of podcast episodes. Just having a safety net or having a backup, or having a Plan B.
00:45:15 Christine–
Yes, the purpose of art is not always to make things is to to connect with yourself, sure, but also with the world.
00:45:24 Christine–
And and I mean that in a very practical sense. You know, you go and look for wood in the forest. Suddenly you discover all these things, you keep walking. You know, the woods around my house, all kinds of music. I I’ve always loved pigments and that, you know, I started wondering where pigs.
00:45:41 Christine–
Originated from and how do you recognize big rings and which one are toxic and how to look for? That’s a huge feel. I wanted to make pieces that meant something moving to Brittany. I just figured out that I was living next to a slate quarry and that the slate was shipped to Paris to cover the historical buildings. So now I’m looking at the.
00:45:46
Right.
00:46:01 Christine–
Party next door and think. Yeah, I traveled all the way through the river system. That’s amazing. I get to appreciate my surroundings and I think that’s the purpose of art is to connect you to the world.
00:46:13 Christine–
When you go travel, you’re not just going to restaurants, you’re going to.
00:46:19 Sage–
I mean, the food’s good. It’s good to.
00:46:20 Sage–
Go check out the food, but.
00:46:22 Christine–
I’m sure, but there’s more to it, you know. Yeah. So so that’s the reason why you become an artist, to love toward you.
00:46:29 Sage–
Yeah, that’s a great way to.
00:46:31 Sage–
Look at it so for you.
00:46:33 Sage–
What is your definition of success for yourself?
00:46:36 Christine–
And there is the right answer, which is to rise to every challenge. But my definition of success is to really develop ball.
00:46:40 Sage–
Right.
00:46:47 Christine–
Because it’s through this balance that you cheat resilience, and there are joy for what you do. So if you’re pursuing your business at the expense of your own happiness, well, sometimes you have to do this because you’ve got to make a living. But if you have a choice, you know, life is about balance.
00:47:06 Christine–
You need to have many interests.
00:47:08 Sage–
Yeah. OK.
00:47:08 Christine–
You need to have.
00:47:09 Christine–
Physical interest, you know, like moving.
00:47:12 Christine–
Gardening blah blah.
00:47:13 Christine–
Blah you need to have intellectual ones. You need emotional ones.
00:47:16 Sage–
Right. And even if it’s, you know, like like some people do have to work hard and may not always be happy, but you can always work towards balance. It’s always something to have as a goal.
00:47:26 Christine–
You have to make sacrifices sometimes. Today say I have to put all my effort to my business because I need to establish it. Well, you know, I I did do that. But also I think try to examine how you can.
00:47:35 Sage–
Yeah, yeah.
00:47:40 Christine–
Other interests into the primary interests right. Often as artists we have trouble reinventing us or or renewing what we make simply because we keep we have so much trouble looking outside our that.
00:47:53 Sage–
Thinking our market.
00:47:54 Sage–
Isn’t going to accept us if we change, yeah.
00:47:57 Sage–
Well, why don’t you go ahead and tell?
00:47:59 Sage–
Listeners what it is that you’re doing currently? Do you have any upcoming projects or classes that we should know about and how to find you?
00:48:08 Christine–
OK. OK. Well, you can find me on Facebook, Christine Jumbo or you can find me on Instagram under Christine under score G under score Dylan G for George cause my.
00:48:22 Christine–
Middle name is George and the Y.
00:48:30 Christine–
And then you can e-mail me at c.d.umont@allovercreation.net.
00:48:40 Sage–
And I’ll put these links in the show notes. If people need to look them up too.
00:48:43 Christine–
Yeah, I’m planning to mentor a very small group of artists and the title is creativity unleashed near this to have biweekly zoom meetings like every other week during which I share my techniques of an insight and to assist participants in recognizing.
00:49:03 Christine–
And addressing counterproductive patterns of thinking. So together we work towards nurturing and developing more productive creative habits.
00:49:13 Sage–
All right.
00:49:14 Christine–
I’m thinking of starting the second week of November. OK. Yeah. So if you’re interested, contact me via e-mail and be aware that seats are limited and some seats.
00:49:27 Sage–
Are filled already.
00:49:28 Christine–
Yeah. And basically, if you like what I said during this podcast, I will go into more details using remodeling techniques.
00:49:38 Sage–
And then you still have the voila group on Facebook.
00:49:41 Christine–
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, you can see how people have used mostly materiality.
00:49:48 Sage–
Class. Yeah, and what they’ve.
00:49:49 Christine–
Made out of that and.
00:49:51 Christine–
See the variety of expression.
00:49:53 Sage–
It’s really interesting to see people’s progression and and where they’ve gone since then too. So all right, well, are there any last words, anything we didn’t cover that you might have wanted to?
00:50:02 Sage–
Tell my listeners.
00:50:04 Christine–
No, I just think that people have to keep learning and keep growing, right? I’m still.
00:50:09 Sage–
With you on that.
00:50:10 Sage–
So with you on that.
00:50:12 Sage–
Alright. Well, Christine, thank you so much for joining us today and for talking through all these stories of yours and your ideas about remodeling and not quite teaching.
00:50:24 Christine–
You rewind your brain really well, said shut up.
00:50:26 Sage–
I I I’m.
00:50:27 Sage–
I’m pretty nimble up there in the in the gelatinous mass, so.
00:50:34
It is. It is. It’s great.
00:50:35 Sage–
It’s perfect, and it’s such a great.
00:50:37 Sage–
Visual too. Well, thank you so much, Christine I.
00:50:39 Sage–
Really appreciate joining us.
00:50:40 Christine–
Well, thank you for having me. Irish. Nothing, yeah.
00:50:45 Sage–
So what do you think? Are you ready to do something different? Embrace contradictions and just be different? It’s definitely something that would take some conscious effort, but I think honestly, all that stuff sounds like fun. Something to try something new, something to push. How you think that lateral thinking conversation?
00:51:04 Sage–
Really sparked ideas for me because although I.
00:51:08 Sage–
Talk about thinking outside of.
00:51:09 Sage–
The box or talk about.
00:51:11 Sage–
Just looking at things differently.
00:51:12 Sage–
It really is a way of.
00:51:15 Sage–
Identifying where your ideas are coming from, and since lateral thinking is problem solving, it’s like if something’s directly in front of you, like.
00:51:22 Sage–
Brick wall. You can think more traditionally or I can’t remember the terminology is, but then you go straight to the wall. You wanna get through the wall. You wanna?
00:51:30 Sage–
Break down the.
00:51:30 Sage–
Wall cause it’s in the way lateral thinking is you thinking OK how can I get around the wall? Or can I climb the wall? Or can I dig under the wall? Or can I go catch?
00:51:38 Sage–
A train to the other side of the continent and come back that way, you know.
00:51:42 Sage–
It’s really thinking in extremely different ways than.
00:51:46 Sage–
Just straight ahead.
00:51:47 Sage–
And if you can do that with your artwork, I think you can find some really interesting new concepts to motivate you and inspire you and really take your work up a notch or just hone what it is that you’re doing right now. So if you want to look into lateral thinking, that might be something to investigate because it really is an interesting concept that I.
00:52:07 Sage–
Think it’s creative?
00:52:08 Sage–
We all do, but being aware of it sometimes really makes a difference in us being able to call on that when we need it. So I hope you really enjoyed that conversation with Christine. I know with the French accent and our tiredness, maybe things might be a little difficult at moments to hear if.
00:52:24 Sage–
To there’s always a transcript of the podcast. Well, definitely on the sagearts.com episode pages and most of the podcast players have access to it, but if you don’t find it where you’re listening, you should be able to find it on the stage. Or.com go to the episodes pages and then go to this episodes now usually have transcripts run through an AI transcriber, but it can be.
00:52:45 Sage–
A little off a moment to say the least. I’ll actually go through this one myself and edit it so it can be read correctly, but in any case give me a few days if you’re listening to this as soon as it’s released, I’m going to need the weekend at least to get.
00:52:57 Sage–
Get done. But in the meantime, if you would like to send me your thoughts about what we just talked about, I’d love to hear from you again. You can go to the show notes or the description, whatever it’s called in your podcast player, and find links to the places where you can contact me, like the sagearts.com where you can go to the contact page there and send me an e-mail. There’s also Facebook and Instagram.
00:53:17 Sage–
Just look for the Sage Arts podcast pages and as mentioned at the beginning, if you’re enjoying the episodes and you find value in what I’m doing here, consider giving back by going to the sagearts.com website. We’re halfway down the homepage, you’ll find guide me a copy or PayPal donation buttons also in the.
00:53:32 Sage–
And if you want to help spread the word about this podcast, you can share anything that I post on the social media pages or in the newsletter, and it really helps also to hit that follow button on your podcast player. The more follows we have, the higher up we appear on search lists, so that helps get more people in on the conversation.
00:53:52 Sage–
With us and on that note, I am going to run off and do 100 other little things I have to do. So go off and try to think differently and be different and embrace those contradictions. Feed your news with new experiences. Be true to your rudeness, and join me again.
00:54:07 Sage–
Next time on.
00:54:07 Sage–
The Sage Arts podcast.
